Hello everyone its somthing i have wondered for awhile. W E. Garret, Bernards Dopplt Fermentiert and Samuel Gawiths Kendel Brown are all quite old if i undersrand correctly. I have always wondered what Wilsons oldest recipe was along with any others not mentioned above. Any info would be appriciated. Thank you, Luke
The oldest WoS type is probably Best SP which dates back to the 1760s. Until relatively recently their water mill, which powered the grinding pestles, was in the Guiness book of records as the oldest functioning machine in the country - although its not used anymore I was told by someone in the know that it still works.
*You are correct about Kendal Brown Original, which is still made according to the Thomas Harrison 1792 recipe by Samuel Gawith. It is almost certainly the oldest UK snuff bearing the same name that is still in production. Because of the copies made by other manufacturers an application was made for a trade mark on 14 November 1877 by William Nevison (Nevinson according to Samuel Gawithâs website). After Samuel Gawith acquired the Eamont Bridge mill in the 1930âs they also acquired the intellectual property. It is due for renewal on 11 July 2013. By law they have the sole right to use the word Original in their distribution of Kendal Brown. The S.P snuffs are without doubt the oldest in continuous production at the Sharrow mill and probably pre-date Kendal Brown. However, no one knows for certain when the S.P appellation became standard. The origins of S.P and just what those two letters stand for have possibly been the source of more speculation than anything else in snuff history. Because of Sheffieldâs association with S.P âSheffield Prideâ has been claimed. While this is unconvincing it seems that the first S.P manufactured in Britain bearing that name originated in Sheffield - possibly at the Sharrow Mill, which still manufactures its flagship snuff under the new name of Best S.P. With the exception of Queens, Tom Buck, Royal George and Rose of Sharrow every item used to be distributed by Sharrow as S.X where S refers to Sharrow and X to the snuff. There was S.T (Tonquin) S.L (Lavender), S.C (Carnation), S.J (Jockey Club), S.W (Wallflower) S.M (Medicated) etc. If this old labelling system (other manufacturers used numbers) is the origin of S.P then S stands for Sharrow while P remains a mystery. Quite possibly S.P is derived from the label for Spanish - here the haul of Havana snuff looted from the Spaniards by Admiral Rooke at Vigo Bay in 1702. This was the first silky-smooth commercially-made snuff introduced in large quantities to Britain. However, unlike the classic bergamot snuff associated with S.P it was almost certainly unscented. Although the original machinery at Sharrow was working went I visited in the 1980s, modern electrical machinery had replaced it, as it had at nearby Westbrook Mill. The water wheel and grinding machinery had been in continual use since 1797 and more probably since 1730. As stated in the previous post it was, until the 1970s, listed in the Guinness Book of Records as the oldest machinery still in continual use in the UK. Most of the snuffs now sold by Wilsons were added to the list after Mark Chaytor became MD. Some have antiquated sounding names but are actually very new. (*text mostly cut and pasted in lazy fashion from some of my earlier posts)
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Iâm not sure which is the oldest WoS, but I believe Old Paris is the oldest Fribourg & Treyer snuff still manufactured, and was the snuff of choice for Beau Brummel.
I would have to agree with PhilipS, also if you go to the WoS website they have a video of the water mill and the grinder in action but also on the website it states that they use modern machinery to get consistent grind levels. Thereâs a lot of great info about WoS on their website definitely worth checking out if you are interested. www.sharrowmills.com
The two oldest continuously manufactured snuffs in existence are the aforementioned Old Paris by F&T, which dates back to 1720, and the Swedish brand Röda Lacket, which originated in 1753. There is anecdotal evidence that other F&T recipes are much older than the Old Paris, but these are the two oldest recipes that have been confirmed by historians. The oldest American snuff still in existence is Lorillard, which dates back to 1758. I donât know how close the current Lorillard Snuff is to the original, but I have an 1898 advertisement that mentions itâs the original â1760â recipe. 1760 was the year Pierre Lorillard started his company, but he had been selling his snuff since at least two years previous.
Well, the only Lorillard left is the sweet scotch. There was a plain scotch that was discontnued some years ago, as well as a maccoboy which only died out in recent times. There was also a rappee and probably some others. Iâm sure it wouldnât be the sweet scotch as the sweetening of snuffs didnât happen until much later. It was probably the rappee since that would have been more familiar to a French immigrant. John Garrett was a Scots immigrant, Iâll bet dollars to doughnuts he introduced scotch snuff to the US by which I mean the British North American colonies. Röda Lacket was originally nasal snuff? Or were the Swedes using it orally that early? BTW, it tastes nothing like its namesake, Red Seal.
âThe two oldest continuously manufactured snuffs in existence are the aforementioned Old Paris by F&T, which dates back to 1720, and the Swedish brand Röda Lacket, which originated in 1753. There is anecdotal evidence that other F&T recipes are much older than the Old Paris, but these are the two oldest recipes that have been confirmed by historians.â Where did you read that Old Paris dates from 1720? Would be interested to read your sources. Old Paris is certainly a very old snuff, but Iâve never seen any evidence that it predates Kendal Brownâs 1791/2 inauguration. (1720 is when Peter Fribourg set up in business.) The earliest surviving ledger of Peter Fribourg, the sole proprietor before Gotlieb Treyer became the proprietor in 1780, dates from 1764 to 1778. There is no mention in the accounts of Old Paris. Old Paris first appears in the accounts of the New Partnership in 1803 of Price Evans and George Evans. Princes Mixture dates from roughly the same time. Both were favourites during the Regency (1811-1820), along with others that have since vanished. Interestingly, Peter Fribourg and Gotlieb Treyer were never in partnership. The latter only succeeded to the business, and it wasnât until the 19th century that the business became known as Fribourg & Treyer.
PhillipS, the dates originally came from staff historian Rob C, who was working from Oskar Nikulaâs âStrengbergs 1762-1962.â We recently were donated a set of Nikulaâs works by the Swedish Tobacco Museum, and weâre having Rob translate notable bits for us (since heâs the only one that is fluent in Finnish). Thereâs a great chapter in one of the books about the origins of nasal snuff and the evolution of snus, and weâre probably going to translate and serialize it in The Ephemeris sometime in 2013. (We have another book scheduled after the Ljunglöf bio is finished.) Scanning through one of the Nikula volumes âTurun kaupungin historiaâ also quotes part of an 1889 letter from Beau Brummel to an admirer in which he describes Old Paris as being that âvenerable and long-lusted of all snuffs.â (This was the only snuff reference from any of the Nikula books I have at my disposal that I could find). @Xander, the Red Seal of today is definitely not the same recipe as the Red Seal of yore. Red Seal was originally imported Röda Lacket before it was manufactured here, where it took on more of an American Scotch flavor. However, the Roda Lacket recipe was still being manufactured as Seal Snus in the midwestern territories. I wrote an article you can google called âThe real history of snus in Americaâ (I think) that outlined the strange history that the brand has experienced throughout the years. (Some of the minor facts were wrong in the article but the basic info regarding the Red Seal/Röda Lacket brand was pretty well-researched, hence probably correct 
Originally Röda Lacket was a dry nasal snuff, but by around 1800 the Swedes began taking this dry snuff and adding casings and syrup which was cooked over a low flame for several days. The resulting batch was called âsnusâ and was meant to be taken orally. By about 1850, the snuff manufacturers had all switched over to moist production and the old method of cooking dry snuff had died out. Röda Lacketâs recipe remained the same, it was just tweaked to retain moisture. Instead of being left to dry out over a period of several weeks, it was fermented for three days and packaged and sold on the fourth.
SnuffPub - Concerning the 1889 letter from Beau Brummel - Iâd be rather wary of your source since Brummell died in 1840! He left his Fribourg & Treyer account in debit in 1815 (and other far greater debts besides) after which he fled to France to escape a debtorâs prison. He died there leaving his account unpaid. The history of Fribourg & Treyer has been the subject of several books written in English, notably The Snuff Shop: Fribourg & Treyer by John Arlott, which makes for an interesting read. Masulipatam, favourite of George IIIâs missy, had a longer pedigree than Old Paris, and was still available from London tobacconists for several years after Fribourg & Treyer closed in 1981. The 18th century original, however, must have been very different as the tobacco was sourced from Cuba instead of India. The rappees in turn were older still.
PhillipS- please excuse my typo- the letter was written in 1829. The John Arlott book is indeed an invaluable resource, we referenced it in our first issue.