I’ve read about sodium bicarbonate used in snuff making to promote bio-availability and/or absorption of nicotine, but I’m not finding details of the process of adding it to snuff. Would it be best to mix sodium bicarbonate with water and have the tobacco absorb it? Or is adding as a dry ingredient suggested.

That would be my question as well but I’ve some experience now. I found that even you add a small amount sodium powder into very dry snuff, e.g., HDT, there’ll be a remarkable raise of nic hit and burning. only my 2 cents.

Found the burning on my first test (mixed dry). 1 teaspoon of bicarb with about an ounce of tobacco. Added water to the mix and reblended it. The burn went way down but the nic hit was still good. I’m thinking the bicarb dust directly in the nose doesn’t make for a fun time.

@snuffgrinder what is the mechanism? How does it increase nic uptake? Does salt have the same type of effect?

say I fill a little smash box (like 5 grams) with a dry scotch and want to try adding some sodium bicarbonate (can we just start calling it baking soda yet?) to see what its effects are like. Are we talking like an almost immeasurable amount here, like just a tiny pile on the edge of a pipe tool spoon? I’m curious about this but I’d like some guidance (not like I’m about to throw a big teaspoon in a tiny smash box or anything… just better safe than sorry!) edit: i’m impatient… I tried this about 30 seconds after posting this question. I added the tiniest little bit I could manage to about 1.5-2g of WE Garrett Scotch and took an average pinch after mixing well. Didn’t put the baking soda in water or anything like you guys mentioned, just added it straight. Really, just a tiny tiny little bit (I emphasize this so nobody does anything potentially stupid). Definitely noticed a much stronger nicotine hit. Came on faster than usual and actually gave me that heavy limb feeling that a big nic hit gives… haven’t had a satisfying nicotine experience like this since I had a tub of Skruf Xtra Sterk. It’s still lingering too which rarely happens with snuff since I’m used to the nicotine of dip. It did not affect the flavor at all. second edit: see this thread from snuson that has a bit of info: http://www.snuson.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-10029.html and also I found a web site that claims nicotine lozenges contain sodium bicarbonate. third edit: good info here: http://books.google.com/books?id=nwwMUU6CwKAC&pg=PA446&lpg=PA446&dq=nicotine+alkalinity&source=bl&ots=tYogYotCCj&sig=JG44nwIinAi5fO19OFiWuk0p\\_kk&hl=en&ei=4-\\_ETfTsBsTr0QGrqbmsCA&sa=X&oi=book\\_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CCwQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=nicotine%20alkalinity&f=false

@Pike Mopers Did you notice anything in terms of stronger burn?

@xapken maybe slightly… wasn’t enough difference for me to even think to take note of that. although, I did sniff this one with a lot of caution instead of just grabbing my usual big pinch and inhaling all nonchalantly so that reduced the burn. I ended up adding more of the original snuff to the mix since it was a real dizzying nic hit… hard to believe that such a tiny amount of baking soda can unleash so much potential for nicotine. I really just put my pipe tool spoon in the box of baking soda and tried to get as little as possible. I’m assuming that this effectiveness varies person to person since that tends to be the case with this sort of thing.

One of the random variables going into this is the manufacturer may have already adjusted ph. I found this from a post here on snuffhouse. http://tinyurl.com/xapkenunprotonated Page 65 and 66 shows some dry snuffs with ph in a chart. The number to look at is % unprotonated. One manufacturer “US Tobacco” has some pretty high numbers. To my surprise Rooster is rather low. I’m thinking that bumping ph on a low ph brand could make it much stronger. I’m not sure about bumping ph on a brand that’s already been bumped up.

Wonder what will happen if I sniff some pure baking powder and then chase it with a pinch of snuff?

I saw a thread about 50-50 snuff and baking powder. Large amounts of pain.

Most snuffs have been ph adjusted to facilitate rapid and a more complete uptake of nicotine. They have a ph of between 5.5 and 7. Some of the ammonia laden snuffs are far higher and kick hard. But once you get above about 6, you start having rapid and pronounced burning effects. Adding Baking soda to snuff will increase the uptake, a little, but the misery factor is Steep. Only the tiny amount that actually binds to, or lands with the snuff is doing anything at all, the rest is just going to sting and burn like hell. The time to add ph adjustments is in the tobacco itself, ie, added to the snuff as a water based solution, then dried. I hate to see some people subject themselves to the pain of playing around with this stuff, I did for quite a while, in order to see what Rustica had to offer, and yes it works a little, but not worth burning the linings of your nose and sinus up. I never found a level of increased pleasure worth the pain. There is a ph level, far less than the 9 max of soda, where that is all there is. Remember, if you chase the nicotine Dragon, he will run and hide from you!

Revisiting the Scotch/Baking Soda mix I made from last night this morning. Got a little lazy with the pinch and it flew up high in my nose and I can safely say that the burn is increased by a little bit. Nicotine is much less overwhelming since I added more snuff to the original mix I did. Overall very nice but I think I just spoiled WE Garrett Scotch cause I wont want to snuff it without the extra kick!

you can use slacked lime to do the same thing, but I find it burns less. It is sold in many grocery stores as pickling lime. Look in the canning section. This is the ingredient most people have used to up the ph in tobacco in the past and currently.

You could also just consider taking a second hit of snuff, that seems to work well for me!

I am so tempted to add some baking soda to my D. White.

I just added some to my F&T HDT and WOW what a boost. The smell isnt affected, but a large pinch feels like a lip full of dip. This is like the first time I got a good pinch of D. White.

Oh jeez… c’mon guys quit trying to make a hard drug outta snuff lol! I never thought I’d see the day where people are trying to freebase tobacco!!!

I think this thread just saved my life. Maybe Ill be able to quit smoking now!

Say i had a 5 gram tin of wilson toast#22 how much baking soda would i have to add to it to get a real big nic hit

@cmorgan87 extremely little. EXTREMELY LITTLE. and remember, you can always add more but you can’t take any away once it’s mixed in. use a small snuff spoon/pipe tool spoon/tip of a scissor blade and take a tiny tiny scoop (it will look like too little to make any difference). Mix it up (I just close the tin and shake it around for like 30 seconds) and start with a small pinch to ‘test the water’ so to speak. If it seems like not enough, keep adding (although I think you’ll find that the tiny amount you add at first is plenty).

@cmorgan87 At 2% a full 5g tin would take 100 mg (1/10th of a gram). That’s about 1/32nd of a teaspoon.

Ultimately, you raise the amount of free/available nicotine and get a good hit for a minute until your tolerance adjusts. I also worry that this is not good for your nose. Someone once recommended to me the use of baking soda as a natural deodorant, it worked fine but repeated applications made the skin very red and tender.

I figured out the issue I was having with ph. Sorry I didn’t think of this without bugging everyone for info, and thanks for being helpful. I am using flavoring designed for soft drinks. It has acids to give the drink tartness. From what I can gather, the acid in with tobacco kills the nicotine hit due to low ph. Adding sodium bicarbonate to the flavoring soup (water flavor salt and sugar) neutralized the acids. With this change I’m now getting a correct nic hit instead of very little. Thanks again.

Weird science! I mean yes it can help with the uptake, but it is rough on the nose, and it really bastardizes the snuff! And boosting a low natural snuff like a HDT, well, count me out. That is why they make Grunt and Snus. If you chase a nic hit, it will just get frustrating fast. Tolerance to nicotine builds faster than your ability to tolerate the burn. It will end badly! I mean they make Bruton, it is high in nic and ph, and is not very loved, that,s why they call it Brutal. Have fun, be careful, enjoy exploring. But get some NTSU! I like my snuffs for taste and balance. Order some Thouc Lao and grind that into snuff with just a smidgen of Salts, that one kicks. That being said I have a kilo of Y1 Frankenstein tobacco ordered, twice the nicotine and the same sweet Virginia taste. That is going to make the snuff you seek, but I will not have to push the ph to do it justice. All of the rustica goodness without the drip. Now there’s a science experiment I can get behind!

“With this change I’m now getting a correct nic hit instead of very little.” DANG. All this time I haven’t been getting a correct nic hit??? Tradition sucks. And to think all these snuff companies needed to do was add some baking soda… lol

I usually add ph ingredients to chewing tobacco or oral tobacco instead of snuff. I like to use snuff for the flavor and other tobacco’s for the nicotine. Ph additives actually have a nice effect on oral tobacco flavors as long as you don’t use baking soda as it is too salty. It’s fun to experiment though.

I will never add baking powder to snuff again. Like Whalen, I tried it with Rustica. All it did was to make the snuff smell like freshly mowed grass. I’ve made LOTS of snuff (not mixed, MADE the stuff) and baking powder FUBARed a lot of my work. Leave that stuff alone, it was made to go through your mouth, not your nose

Baking soda is good for brushing the ol’ bicuspids, though.

@bart So is snuff from what my Indian friends tell me

Oh wow kodiak has 65+ percent free based nicotine lol that explains the heart palpitations.

I’ll not be messing with NaHCO3 in my snuff!! I realized a long time ago that too much of any chemical at one time is a recipe for destruction. Putting a chemical into your body is one thing. (pacing it). Putting it in faster then your body knows what to do with it is another. Spins, cold sweats, nausea, praying to god to make it stop, swearing that you’ll never do it again. No thanks! That was called high school. Been there , done that, bought the T-shirt, never going back!!

has anyone tried sodium carbonate? Im told it can be made by heating baking soda to 400F for 2 hours. I believe this is the same thing as soda ash. I’ve only seen recipes for using it as a solution before drying but was wondering if anyone has used it dry?

Soda ash and salt are the two main snuff making additives for my home made snuff. Playing around with these additives is not recommended by me. There is a limit to how much it can increase the uptake of an EXISTING snuff, maybe a tad, then it just messes up everything, your nose, for example. Yes it takes a little PH adjustment to help with uptake of nicotine from a base RAW tobacco, just a smidge (1 to 2 %), then it increases the nose burn exponentially, as in a hell of a lot. Adding these PH adjusters to a already processed snuff, is “stupid” IMHO. I always use a 1% by weight amount of these in pure water to start processing any raw tobacco into snuff, only then do I consider more adding more. Too much will render the snuff into a caustic experience. Bad move. Adding baking soda to an existing snuff to get an increased amount of nicotine is a good way to ruin some snuff and burn the dickens out of your sinus. If you want to increase the amount of nicotine uptake from a snuff just take another freekin pinch! Its not Rocket Surgery here boys and girls. Sorry but the concept of turbo charging snuff with PH additives is juvenile.

@Gsnuff sodium carbonate made in this way is unstable and will not last very long without reabsorbing carbon atoms and reverting back to a bicarbonate. Using it dry no problem but it does need moisture to create an “active” relationship with tobacco. Whalen, by the way is, completely correct in stating that adding additional alkalizing agents to an already alkalized snuff is foolish.

I’ve never had any luck with dry blending alkalines. Easiest I’ve found would be to make a solution with water, sprinkle (or spray?), blend well, wait for it to dry and work out the clumps. My preference is calcium hydroxide (slaked lime) which is used in snuff from India. A little bit goes a long way. I use 2 teaspoons per pound of pipe tobacco (454 grams). I haven’t tested this ratio with snuffs. I’m guessing something like 1/2 of 1 percent by weight. Overdoing it, just makes it taste bad when smoked, and probably nostril burn when snuffed.

Thanks for all the feedback! @Juxtaposer Sometimes I want the full snuff experience… aroma, taste, a little lift. My favorite is Toque H&Whisky and I wouldnt dream of adding powder to it. Im OK with being juvenile, it not that, I just agree it tastes bad. Other times, it’s 2AM, I still have to hammer out a proposal and I can’t think straight. Thats when I need a spike of nic. Not “another pinch”… a spike that sends me over a threshold and the concentration kicks back in. For this Ill go the full 9-yards (without smoking): Rustica, fine ground, 10% soda ash as solution, and to heck with the taste.

It’s difficult to see any home concoction delivering higher nic levels than Quit or White, which were professionally made to do the thing you are looking for. I don’t see any ‘home brew’ delivering more than two, pea sized, pinches of white, whatever you do to it. It’s more complex than just adding the right ingredients together. I’m not saying you can’t make high nic snuff at home, I’m just saying it would be very difficult to improve on what you can buy. Snuff has never been about getting vast amounts of nicotine and really this is diverging from what snuff is - you might be better going down other routes if pure nicotine is the only goal. The youtube video-blogger TropicalBob has methods of making ultra high nicotine vaping devices from e-cigarettes, which might suit you better. Otherwise, it’s a bit like making a 747 into a fighter - arguably doable in some ways but conceptually a dead end.

@snuffster @snuffgrinder - Very definitive stuff and sounds dead on. Thanks! Its the nic paradox - Always wanting more but want to stay within the confines of snuff due to its superior risk/benifit profile. I THINK (but do not know for sure) that it may have less health risks than gum/lozenges. As an aside, I LOVE my Quit… but should probably try White. Being in the US, shipping and customer service add value to snuff. Quit and the company behind it have both been good to me. Time to give White a fair shake. Thanks again!

@snuffgrinder - I was just referring to the simple addition of bicarb on its own. Of course people make snuff at home etc - I was implying a complexity of approach that someone new to snuff would not have.

I know this is an old thread, but I tried sodium carbonate as an additive when I made my own snuff. It did seem seem to make it somewhat more “powerful”, but not that much. It just seemed to make the snuff on a par with the commercially available ones. That is, it had a decent nicotine hit, and was overall a useful additive in my recipe.

“Snuff has never been about getting vast amounts of nicotine and really this is diverging from what snuff is - you might be better going down other routes if pure nicotine is the only goal. Otherwise, it’s a bit like making a 747 into a fighter - arguably doable in some ways but conceptually a dead end.”

Very well said. Personally, I do not look to snuff as a nicotine delivery system. If that is your holy grail, there are several far more efficient systems and methods. Snuff, for me, is about the overall experience; good tobaccos handled with care, scented with a gentle hand to enhance, rather than overwhelm, the tobacco and finally, the pleasant sensations that come over me after indulging in a well made snuff. The same “argument” applies to the cost of snuff, artisan vs others. Apples and Oranges comes to mind. I can get a gallon of Gallo Hearty Burgundy for half the price of a .750L bottle of Cline Ancient Vines Zinfandel. I can also get a box of Swisher Sweets for the price of a single Cohiba Siglo IV. I can, (and do-because I like it), buy four 4.65 oz tubes of Swisher Starr snuff for less than one 50 gram jar of one of the most loved snuffs on this forum…which I also buy frequently from Mr. Snuff, also because I like it. For the record, I would very much like to have a front row seat for the inaugural flight of the F-747/A Fighter Jet.

An increase in the burning is probably due to the fact that adding sodium bicarbonate is skewing the pH level of your snuff. That means that it is merely making it more of an irritant.