The Toque image to your left, states, ‘An Old Idea, A New Focus.’ I’m definitely new. Though the search doesn’t support a review of comments by user, I’ve tried to do some homework by searching through resident historians’ previous posts here for some perspective; for example, the discussion of classifications. History is not necessarily the same as current and future states of affairs. If the schmalzlers, which I’ve found that I like quite a bit, make me feel like I need to wax my mustache, fluff my cravat and be careful to turn my head at the correct speed for the plume in my hat to flair properly and with dignity, the Spanish Gem brought to mind, the Buck Rogers clean openness of space, toward the future rather than the past. It’s no secret that I think menthol is misused by Herr Poschl, but I add very small amounts to some blends for a spacial effect. This was totally unnecessary with the Spanish Gem for an even more spacial openness. I doubt this was an issue of flavoring. While florals are not yet to my taste, I interpret SG Dark Cob as very sophisticated for what it is, if that makes sense to anyone. I’m not talking about gourmand versus medicated, though it may be a valid assertion that that’s all there is. Though grind may be coarse, comparing NTSU to schmalzlers would be a bit of a stretch, then what do I know? Grind, method of flavoring, and the other classification parameters are very interesting, but difficult to translate to ‘effect’ characteristic tendencies. What are the differences you envision in the past and future of snuff effects? What is the difference in the characteristics of tradition, and the direction of modernity? What characteristics of the past have stood the test of time? What’s new? Where is the interface with aromatherapy and other herbal effects, if there is one. What do you see as the future?
An interesting point. It seems to me that the developments have been very superficial - more to do with how snuff is sold and packaged rather than any real movement towards genuinely different snuffs; any interface with aromatherapy principles at this time is purely accidental - so someone using, say, a lavender snuff will get aromatherapy type benefits as a default rather than design of the manufacturer. Its worth remembering though that some of the major companies are in the UK and the tobacco world is very tightly controlled here - the only advertising, as such, is on websites and this surely has an effect on development. We are in the early days of a snuff renaissance due to the smoking bans creeping across the globe. Snuff has to be accepted wholesale as a main alternative to smoke and thats why - I feel - the main developments so far have been in packaging, marketing and an evergrowing list of flavours. One has to ask how snuff could develop and thrive in the modern world given that it is a tobacco product - I think that question has yet to be fully resolved.
It’s been my belief, possibly incorrectly, that long experience has tangible value in results. The traditional houses that have been in business for hundreds of years have learned a thing or two. That doesn’t mean that there isn’t a role for invention. At some point of history, menthol, with its synergistic effect with nicotine, was considered an innovation. How it became the one-trick pony of Poschl would be interesting, but no pipe tobacco or cigar smoker would dream of putting menthol in their product. If there is a market for it at all, it’s not worth the cost of production. The menthol cigarette market is famously narrow, a comedian making a joke of the association to good effect. My hypothesis is that there is more to the ‘New Focus,’ of Toque than the expansion of flavors. It’s also worth remembering that eventually, children-friendly flavors, Blueberry already there, inevitably to bubble-gum and cotton candy, will attract unwelcome US FDA attention. Dholakia White and NTSU have the strength, but without the spacial effect of Spanish Gem. More downer than up, if you will. Is the ‘smokiness’ of American Scotch an asset or liability? I’d suggest the latter. “One has to ask how snuff could develop and thrive in the modern world given that it is a tobacco product -” I may be wrong, but I think that traditional tobacco flavor, as with long-term other types of tobacco use, has at it’s core an appreciation of the taste of tobacco. Heavy menthol is for a narrow few, and not the realm of a long-term market. Similarly, most agree that the movement of tobacco use is away from cigarettes. Possibly toward snuff. Is that gourmand and scented, perhaps. The issue of quality is constant. What defines quality?
They removed the clove cigarettes from the shops around here. They say the FDA rules against flavored cigarettes forced them to. I wonder what future problems this will cause in the emerging snuff market?
I get a traditional feeling of snuff from the brands that are from “old snuffhouses” but I think that’s mainly because I’ve been told about them, or better yet I’ve read about them. Brands, producers, and blends have been written about throughout history. When taking them I have on occasion recanted some of the articles I’ve read that mentioned them and I get a sense of history. Take this with a grain of salt due to my limited snuff experience (I’m probably still under 100) An observation that I’ve made is that most of the brands that have been around for a long time are similar. By this, I mean that I think that I could pick out a Bernards, a Dholakia, SG, (or even McC’s, WoS if I’m familiar with the blends) for being from that manufacturer. This doesn’t always hold true, for example F&T. Now I believe Toque to be a relatively new company (strictly because of the logo) and the bits that I’ve read on here. I admit my ignorance though, I haven’t read up on the company itself. I do notice that Toque has a very wide range of flavors yet I think that I could still pick the Toque in a blind test. I guess that proves Rodrick’s diligence, attention to detail, and lasting quality. A new label from old producers might be the answer moving forward from cigarettes to snuff and snuff-like products. @ Carol - I think the FDA/ATF and government in general will make it extremely difficult for snuff, at least in the US.
Toque came into being about three years ago. However, you don’t just start producing snuff from scratch - the methods are very old and arcane; it’s not like opening a new grocery store - and my guess is that Roderick has some ex- member of one of the old houses working for him. He has been quite guarded about the exact set up of the business; which in business is understandable. I get a definite sense of history with some snuffs; a pinch of french carotte, cafe royal or burgundy immediately conjour up images of gentlemen’s clubs and silver snuff boxes.
Maybe it’s folly or conceit on my part but I am attempting to make snuffs from scratch. I figure that’s the only route to making something that is truly unique. Time will tell. I have a “beta test” version of my product circulating among members here. I will learn a lot from their comments and the snuff will evolve to reflect peoples’ taste. It’s made in an entirely different way from English snuffs. I have borrowed from here and there, but copied no one. Actually I used a Ouija board to channel the spirit of a master snuff maker from …oh never mind.
Hello, Honey Bee in my nose. I wanted to touch on this question, if it’s still on the table. “Where is the interface with aromatherapy and other herbal effects, if there is one.” I believe that the interface is crossed from old witch doctor methods. A little bit of this and that, trial and error, before penicillin. As I venture into snuffing tobacco, finding that 19th century companies; whether bought by Swisher, or Wilsons, makes me think that the time between these companies’ conception and my clicking on a few sites on the internet is about a hundred years give or take. And this time is a nice cushion. I mean, comparing my perspective to the endurance of these companies leaves me to believe that if I read that sacharin sweetens American sweets, so? Try it a little chilled.
Companies who produce snuffs have to be very careful about the representations they make concerning the benefits of use of their products. When I first started this, I couldn’t understand why someone would want to snuff or smoke something without tobacco as a component, i.e. Tiger Guarana, or RockIt. In pipe smoking context, aromatherapy made more sense than unnecessary exposure to smoke if you didn’t want tobacco or nicotine. Burn incense. When I don’t understand something, I start reading, in this case to get a perspective on the various ‘traditional’ flavorings of snuff. It seems more than coincidental that certain aromas have been popular across English-speaking generations. Certain aromas may have a beneficial effect on the sense of well-being of a user, beyond the relief of incipient nicotine withdrawal, and masking slaughterhouse or ‘dirtiest job’ odors. Ayurvedic medicine was cited with respect to the Sun snuffs roll-out: I didn’t want to open the can of vitriol and acrimony that unsubstantiated claims incite, but I think that there is an effect of aromas upon users, beyond reminiscences. Anecdotally, I’ve found that certain aromas have an effect, apart from the issue of tobacco, in my case, chocolate is melloing. This is admittedly a separate issue from the distilled question of how one would assess something as having high quality, flavoring aside. “Try it a little chilled.” Is it Honey Bee that one should try chilled?
I have judged the quality of the snuff from different snuffmakers by their most plain unscented style snuffs. On top of that most scents can be fully discovered. Some scents go well, others antagonize the tobaccos used. This is a matter of opinion as there are scents that I disagree with. Thus far I have not come across any low quality snuff even of my own creation. This of course may simply be due to my addiction to nicotine. Top quality snuff, I have come across. The special handling and care taken by some snuffmakers has yielded some outstanding and world class snuffs. i.e. fermenting, aging, marrying, liqueuring, scenting, etc. As for additive effects, a little imagination can go a long way. Look into herbal medicine for details regarding scenting, this may ignite some answers. Furthermore, about mineral oil (paraffin)…it’s much more sanitary than lard.
and it doesn’t go rancid either
What are the differences you envision in the past and future of snuff effects?The actual effects it has physically to the user, or effects it has on those around the user? As far as the physical effects, I’m of the opinion there has been and will be no difference, as long as ingredients remain simple and pure (ie., No chemical concoction like they add to cigarettes).What is the difference in the characteristics of tradition, and the direction of modernity?Marketing and packaging are the obvious differences in my mind. With the better containers we have these days, especially when purchasing smaller portions, the shelf life can be prolonged. I don’t think anyone will argue against the fact that snuff in a plastic box with a flip-top lid that closes snugly will preserve snuff better than a crude paper envelope. As for marketing, the internet has the largest impact on snuff. If not for the internet, we would not be here discussing this topic now. Nor would many of us have the pleasure of owning the fine suffs that we do, because we would not have heard of them. One thing that many might not think of right away is the difference in flavoring. I’m not only speaking of the variety of flavors, but how the flavoring is actually produced. Modern technology allows for the creation or, at the very least, a simulation of a whole plethora of flavors. I’ll use Toque as a prime example. How many snuff producers were thinking of or even had the ability to add peanut butter flavor to snuff 100+ years ago? What characteristics of the past have stood the test of time? What’s new?I’d have to say that the quality of the snuff produced by those companies in the business for a century or better have well stood the test of time. As far as what’s new, there seems to be no shortage of relatively newer flavors hitting the market, even by the old hats of the trade. While the snuff mills of old may still function and produce a fine product, technology has no doubt benefitted those willing to invest. I’ll use Poschl for this example. Watch the video on their site. Their equipment enables them to produce a quality product in a very efficient manner. Not that I see anything wrong with the old methods/machinery.Where is the interface with aromatherapy and other herbal effects, if there is one.To borrow the old phrase, “beauty is in the eye of the beholder.” Walking into a quality candy shop or even a coffe house could be aroma therapy to some. Aromatherapy has never struck me as an exacting science anyway. It’s more of an art. I don’t think this will be a main focus of snuff going forward. Though some may touch on it.What do you see as the future? One word: Regulation. It’s no secret to our small community that snuff is in its infancy of regaining some ground in the tobacco industry. And as with anything that gains or regains popularity, someone out there with money, power, or influence is going to want to regulate it. Most likely it will be several groups of people. Don’t forget, snuff was at one point the most popular form of taking tobacco. In some areas it was embraced, and outright banned in others. Snuff is still flying under the radar as the ratio of its users to those of other forms of tobacco are quite small. It’s not yet worth any governments’ time to evaluate. Rest assured, once it starts to really pick up steam, especially in the States, it will garner the attention of the U.S. FDA. Especially since many snuff products “have flavors that appeal to children” and “is used in similar fashion to cocaine.” For this reason, I almost hope snuff doesn’t gain much more popularity.
Well done Bill. I sincerely hope snuff will regain it’s rightfull place in society. People often ask me: “Ain’t you scared to put that rubbish up your nose”? My reply then is: “I’ll rather put the rubbish up my nose than to sniff exhaust gas like smokers do”. (must admit, a good cigar is super nice!)