Firstly sorry for my the question, new to snuff still and a tad confused. Is Lundy Foot a scotch or a toast ? and what’s the difference? I recently bough Lundy foot and thoroughly enjoy it … (Will get a bigger tin next time) what other snuffs would be “like” Lundy foot it your opinion, I would like to order a few more of these types of snuff , I already have the Toque almond toast , I was thinking of WoS as they do a 6 pack selection of small sample tins (Already have No 22 on the list) Thank you

Derek, this is one of “those” subjects that can bring a difference of opinion, like the definition of SP snuff. My take is Lundy Foot is a toast. The absolute best toast ever made, IMHO. Scotch snuff is usually American and has a distinct smoky, almost BBQ scent; it’s smoky in the same genre as Latakia and Dark Fired tobaccos. Toasts, also just my opinion, aren’t cooked to that extreme and don’t have the smoky scent at all. To me toasts are the ultimate all day snuff because they don’t clog my sinuses and are evocative of many other scents; toasted bread, roasted nuts, butter, freshly baked croissants, etc. Scotch snuff evokes scents of campfires, BBQs, fireplaces and wood smoke. Good examples of toast are F&T High Dry Toast, Wilsons Toast #21 and #22, Toque Natural Toast; SG Irish D Light is almost a hybrid of toasts and Scotch, being subtly smoky. Wilsons Toast #20 has an SP scent with Bergamot and Citrus. In a category all its own is Sir Walter Scott’s Havana Toast. Made from excellent cigar leaf, expertly toasted and blended and oh so damn good. If you want Vitamin N nirvana smoke a Cohiba Esplendido while snuffing mass quantities of Havana Toast and sip a few dozen Mojitos. Repeat as needed. There are dozens of Scotch snuffs available here in the US, where they have a large following of users as oral dip; nasal, not so much. Swisher International has a large variety of Scotch and Sweet Dry Snuffs, as do American Snuff Company (used to be Conwood) makers of Garrett, Peach, Tuberose and many others. The best toast and Scotch snuff don’t use stems. All of these tend to deliver one hell of a nicotine punch and can be tough to take for newbies. Takes practice. The only way to find your favorites is to try them. There are many fine folks here that will trade small samples of snuff so you don’t have to invest in a whole tin and then find it not to your liking. My favorites, for what it’s worth are: Toasts 1. Lundy Foot 2. Fribourg and Treyer High Dry Toast 3. Wilsons Toast #22 4. Toque Natural Toast Scotch 1. Starr 2. Tops Mild/Dry 3. Square 4. Bruton Then you get to explore all the sweets and scented toasts. Roderick at Toque is a genius for scented toasts. Try all of his. Just my long winded opinions. Cheers and have fun

It might be a question of semantics here. Toasts and scotches are nearly identical in terms of dryness, grind and texture. I’m going to disagree [unusually] with @Lunecat (Although he’s been on the forum longer than me and may know some stuff I don’t); I would say that Lundy Foot is a toast. To my mind these are indeed ‘cousins’ separated by geography. Toasts are an old UK style, whilst Scotches are the American interpretation of the classical UK style. Scottish and Irish immigrant to the US brought this style of snuff with them when the emigrated there and hence the style became generically known as ‘Scotch’ snuff, as opposed to the moist snuff products favoured by the Scandinavian immigrants (the forerunners of today’s snus products). Originally American scotches where taken nasally, but as this fell out of fashion, this snuff style became used for ‘dipping’ orally in the southern states of the US particularly. I would speculate that thisis why American scotches fall in to three broad types; regular (strong), mild and sweet. However, ironically, when taken nasally these are usually similar to European toasts, except that some have a stronger smoky/barbeque type scent. There are guys on the forum who are more conversant in this style than me: @chefdaniel @Southern_Snuffster @Xander know loads about this snuff style.

Oopsie… All posting at the same time!!

Thank you gents, I think this may be a mixture from Mr Snuff as opposed to a WoS or just Toque. Particularity interested in Fribourg and Treyer High Dry Toast, Wilson’s Toast #22, Toque Natural Toast, Paul Gotard Latakia ? And Havana Toast if I could get my hands on any … You notice the big hint there… If there are any UK snuffers who would sell a few ounces? Interesting so Toques are all Toasts ? Love my Toques . except Berwick brown …Sometimes… but that’s a whole other thread! Derek

@Derek_007 Only if they have ‘toast’ in the name Though to be fair in terms of the flour type and grind these are mostly finely ground, dry snuffs, with a few exceptions. Lime toast, almond toast, toast and marmalade are all interesting scented toasts

I think it has been said that Lundy Foot is a toast, inspired by the original toast style and named after the tobacconist that first offered a toast on his snuff roaster. The info here (http://www.snuffbox.org.uk/vars.htm) explains that. What Sir Walter says on his info page (http://theartisansnuffsociety.com/sir-walter-scott-fine-border-snuff/) has been said to be not entirely accurate by @PhilipS on some previous post discussing the nature of toasts, scotches and their differences, as he traced a different etymology for the “Scotch” denomination (coming from “Scottish” instead of “Scorched”, like @MisterPaul said) and was used to define any kind of fine snuff, but it could be applied to Lundy Foot nonetheless as it is indeed fine in mill. Nowadays I believe that the difference between toasts and scotches is marked by oceanic separation and all of its consequences (including independent evolution) more than by any other thing.

I think the name Lundy Foot as used by Sir Johnny is an homage to the legendary snuff of the same name. Hard to say since there aren’t any living human beings that used the original. Vampires? Maybe. I would recommend a side by side tasting of three toast and three Scotch snuffs to ascertain their inherent differences. I think one good dose of HDT with another of say, WE Garrett Scotch (after a long break) will make those differences clear. Etymology and semantics aside I would offer that the two styles have three common denominators: 1) They are both made from tobacco. 2) They are both dried by mechanical means. 3) They both are both milled to an ultra fine grind. Other than those only your nose knows.

If you rule out Lundy Foot and Havana Toast, F&T High Dry Toast would probably emerge as a much cited best-in-class classic toast. Considering it’s about a third of the price of the other two and more generally available – to the extent that any snuff is “generally available” – it’s definitely worth a try. According to my own, personal definition, a toast is unscented. I realize that I’m probably the only person who insists that’s the case, and it’s not at all logical, but to me, “lime toast” is an oxymoron. But don’t listen to me on that, that’s just me. Some of the Indian snuffs, if not exactly toasts, are very toast-like. I’m thinking of Dholakia Sparrow, something of a favourite of mine, which is less subtle and complex than the three I mentioned above, but tastes quite similar, although with a very weighty nicotine punch. I usually use that one when I really feel the need for a high dose.

I would also like to point out another great option being Hoggarth Irish D. Definitely overlooked but a great option in my mind.

Some additional clarification might be in order here. The “BBQ/Campfire/Fireplace/Smoky” scents found in most Scotch snuffs in the US come from the percentage of Dark Fired Burley in the formula. These companies use every last bit of raw material in their product lines to maximize profit. Dark Fired is smoke cured on the stalk in barns over hardwood fires . After the leaf is stripped from the stalk they are used for twist chew, dip, loose leaf and other products. The stalk is loaded with flavor and nicotine and costs the same per pound as the leaf. It’s also essentially wood so can’t be used in traditional leaf applications. Being a stick of smoked wood the tobacco processors are left with few profitable options. So they toast it further in gas fired kilns then pulverize it into a very fine powder. Voilà. Scotch snuff. The final product is treated with flavors and salts to modify pH, etc. before packaging for retail sale. It is also blended with air cured stalk and stem to balance the smoky notes. Sweet Scotch uses stalks from primed and air cured burley and a high percentage of sugar as well as the usual chemistry voodoo. No dark fired is generally used, but some brands have a small percentage in the recipe to enhance the aroma of the final product. Toasts on the other hand use little (SG Irish D Light) or no dark fired tobacco in the blend, and most have no burley in the recipe, depending on other varieties to achieve the desired brand identity. Flue Cured Virginias and Orientals are the primary ingredients of classic UK toasts. The best use leaf with the mid-rib removed; no stems or stalks. This results in a fluffier product. Viking Blonde is essentially a toast with distilled water and propylene glycol (humectant) added to increase moisture and make for easier use. SWS Havana Toast is a genius driven snuff in a class of its own. I’m getting low & hope Sir Johnny is diligently procuring more raw materials so he can sell it in 1 kilo drums. That is a subtle hint to Johnny. The closest the US comes to a toast snuff would be the Sweet varieties made from air cured stalk and stem. Because the use shifted from nasal to oral use over time, the percentage of sugar also increased. The US companies have the capabilities to make a toast but not the financial motivation. IMHO the closest a US Dry Snuff comes to a Toast is Starr, essentially an unsweetened “Sweet” Scotch snuff made by Swisher International. Damn good but very hard to find. I was introduced to it very recently but greedily hoovered up my meager stash and am now searching for more.

@chefdaniel Great post! I adhere to the petition to Sir Johnny, as I’ve not been able to purchase Havana Toast while stocks lasted and I would be quite sad if I couldn’t (as a lover of Montecristo and Cohiba cigars).

@chefdaniel, yes, nice post. You inspire me to get hold of some Viking Blonde – a small tin only, I have my reservations. And @stogie, you inspire me to get hold of the Hoggarth Irish D.

Thank you all for your kind words. I live in the heart of Tennessee and Kentucky tobacco country. In the fall I can get pounds of good burley just walking down the road after the “baccy wagons” go by. It just flies out the back of the trucks. Makes good chew. The Green River Valley in Kentucky is about 30 minutes north of my house so I’m a frequent visitor. I ask a lot of questions over a few adult beverages and get a ton of knowledge from the old timers. Adairsville is considered the king of dark fired burley towns. You can smell it for miles when all the barns are at full tilt. I’m a serious fan of HDT and recommend it highly. Viking Blonde is damn good too and I get into that when I need a toast hit without the usual challenges. Hoggarth Irish D and SG Irish D Light are both very good too. The SG has some good smoky notes on top of a very good straight up toast. The Hoggarth is also good for an intro to toast and also has some “Scotch” notes running through it.

Thank you, so much good information available on this forum it never ceases to amaze me. Mr snuff order being prepared, I have a toast feast brewing… … For me, toasts in the day are easy use, no clogging, no runney nose, then my toques at the end of the day and more moister snuffs such as Mull of Oa, trice brewed, etc once the kids are in bed and I have a complimentary brew to hand Moist snuff whilst relaxing with a cold beer is just the perfect end to the day … I have said it before, but I wish I found you lot years ago! Thank you I still got to try that Cafe 11 though … its on my list Derek

@chefdaniel‌ You have inspired at add starr from Mr Snuff to my order https://mrsnuff.com/product\\_info.php?products\\_id=289&osCsid=3a4ecff0e2e300ca41fd3a736610c96c

Yes, I’ve never really seriously considered ordering any American snuff before, but if a man with such obviously impeccable taste as @chefdaniel, demonstrated by his advocacy for HDT, Lundy Foot, and Havana Toast, recommends Swisher Starr Scotch, I might have to try it. Apart from anything else, a very nice looking tin: