Hi, I’ll probably be in London some day next week and I’m thinking about a visit in G Smith & Sons shop. Do any of you know what are their opening hours? And which of their snuffs would you recommend?

I cannot remember what time they are open from, but I know they close at about 6pm. It’s a really great shop and worth a visit however, the owners rather let it down. As for snuff worth having a look at, cafe royale goes without saying. I’d recommend George IV as well… Other than that, not sure what else. Oh although on a side note, they are rather expensive.

They Currently Sell G Smith & Sons Snuffs £7.30 per 25 grams Attar of Roses Cardinal Menthol Cinnamon Café Royale Golden Cardinal George IV Kendal Brown Princes Dark Spanish Special Menthol SP Best Top Mill Wild Strawberry Friborg & Treyer Medium Size £4.55 Large £8.45 ALL cheaper online Bordeaux High Dry Toast Macouba Morliax Old Paris Princes Princes Special Santo Domingo Seville Dr James Robertson Justice If you do go I’d say you must try the Café Royale, the flagship snuff. It’s very nice but costs £7.30 per 25 grams. Some will say you can reproduces it by mixing other snuffs but I’m glad I tried the original.

Although you maybe able to ‘reproduce’ it by mixing other snuffs. There is nothing like the original at all. It’s a snuff you have to try at least once in your life.

@Snuffin “It’s a snuff you have to try at least once in your life” i’d second that, my sister got me some a little while back and, it’s nice

Hell if I’am ever in london I gotta get some Smith and Sons. Just because

In this order 1) Golden Cardinal 2)George IV 3) Spanish (if you have any money left after the first 2)

I guess as a one-off its ok but, when you think you can get six toques for the same money! Or 9 WoS Irish #22 toast from mysmokingshop…makes you think

Money is not a problem, I just want some nice souvenirs, and what can be a better souvenir from London than couple of nice tins of snuff And yes, I am lazy, I have like 30 minutes by train to get to London, I just never have time to go there I’ll definitely take the Cafe Royale as I love coffee snuffs. Xander, could you try to describe for me those three you wrote about?

Well, Spanish is basically an SP. Its kind of like Wilsons Grand Cairo a bit. I don’t know how to describe George IV. Nutty, spicy, kind of like chocolate cake maybe? But not really chocolatey? Almonds, I think some have said. Its moist, somewhat sweet, just really tasty. Golden Cardinal is semi-floral semi SP like. I’ve heard its just Sam Gawith’s Bouquet under a different label, but I’ve never had Bouquet so thats hearsay. I’ve had Wild Stawberry, Cinnamon, Best Dark, and Kendal Brown also. All are very good, but perhaps not completley unique. Their Cinnamon and Strawberry are better than Wilson’s versions though. The large size vacuum sealed tins are pretty nice. You get a nice “whoompf” sound when you open them and the snuff is fresh and smells great. You can’t beat a souvenir like that!

I have both Golden Cardinal and Gawith’s Bouquet by courtesy of Ermtony. Both are jewels but they’re not the same.

I’d go for Cafe Royale and Spanish. Regarding the vacuum sealed tins - I’d recommend you check that the tins are still vacuum sealed after you’ve bought them and take them back if they aren’t. The clueless staff at the shop frequently crack them open to let potential customers have a smell of the contents. They’re normally okay about swapping them over (it’s happened to me twice now).

The Cafe Royale my sister picked-up didn’t come in a vacuum sealed tin, came in a plastic pot.

Yeah, my George IV came in a plastic pot as well. That being said it’s still nice and fresh. I’ve had maybe 2g of it so far? So about 23g left. Not something you would want to take everyday but nice for a treat now and then when the mood strikes… Although I would agree with Xander on the George IV, it’s nutty, spicey, has a hint of clove I believe and just rather nice. Reminds me of Christmas.

In addition to the advice given by BradMajors, it might be worth phoning Smiths first to make sure they have want you want in stock. I went there last April to buy some Café Royale and, amazingly, they didn’t have any in stock. +44 (0) 20 7836 7422

Plastic pots ? It’s been quite a while since I was in Smith’s but that must be a recent development. Could one of you maybe post a picture ?

I have a tin of George IV by courtesy of Debbie and I can say this is a must have. Not an everyday snuff but you will be poorer without it.

They actually close at 5.30pm prompt, so get there early. It’s a very good idea to phone ahead and ask what they have in stock as they don’t always (hardly ever) have a full range of their own snuffs in stock. You can also buy smaller tins at about £4.50 ish, but again, they don’t always have a full stock. I’d recommend George IV, Café Royale and Wild Strawberry. They also have Smith’s Mix, which is like a Kendal Brown. If you have time, try to pop into the Segar and Snuff Parlour in Covent Garden Market, which sells Mullins & Westley snuff - Jock’s Choice & Mature Crumbled would be my top picks there. Happy Shopping!

Is that really a G&H label??? Really???

@ cstokes I with you Is that really a G&H label???\\ Really???

I did wonder that, i guess they make it for them ? not sure…

I know that either GH or SG actually make Smiths’ snuffs, but I forget which. It looks like it might well be GH…

What a rip. Sure, Gawith & Hoggarth make some good snuff, but… not good enough to simply re-label it and sell it for 5 times the cost of the other brand.

I guess that picture answers that question about Cafe Royal anyway. It doesn’t tell us who makes the rest, except that we know (from the horse’s mouth, so to speak) that SG make Golden Cardinal.

Wow, I guess that cat is out of the bag for good now! That’s not just a look-a-like label a la Atherthon’s. It really says Gawith Hoggarth right on it! I guess that’s why Dry Orange reminds me of my old Smith’s Lemon. I think I read once that Smith’s contracted with both GH and SG depending on which blend. I’ll get the Kendal Browns out tonight and maybe the Princes and do some comparisons. Thanks for the photo, iceman.

ermtony for the win.

@ cstokes4: Smith’s have their own unique blends, they just get someone else to make them. That’s not the same as re-labelling existing product.

No Worries, my sister said that George IV comes in the same pots as well…

I think one of us needs to buy that shop and put it to rights again.

I know, Toffee. It’s just the idea that they sell it for an extreme price when you can get a snuff made by the same company on the cheap. I think it’s My Smoking Shop that has GH 25g tubs for a few quid. In the meantime, Smiths is selling a snuff made by the same people for 4-5 times that amount.

My Smoking Shop sell GH 25g tubs for £1.99

@ cstokes4: Yeah, you’re right. I suppose they’re selling the cachet of the brand. Cafe Royale used to be the most expensive snuff in the world - I guess they want to keep it that way.

My kid sister took the pix while getting my xmas gift, Café Royale

@ ukiceman Thanks For Sharing! It would be a Dream to visit there one day!

You know, I second the motion that one of us should buy that place. Better yet, why don’t several people all come together and buy it? Equal ammount contributed, equal share of the profits… Anyway, yes George IV does come in the same pot, I have one of their 25g myself. The label does say GH but as Toffeenose said, they simply have the make it for them (using their recipes). The place is well worth a visit, their products well worth buying however I wouldn’t use them as a frequent supplier. They are extremely over-price and the people running it down let the ship down. One chap there, a young black fellow was wearing baggy trousers, an untucked shirt and tie. Another, a large man was very… Rough around the edges shall we say… However, there was another chap, with a beard, very knowledgable and helpful. Seemed like he cared for the shop rather than it being just a source of income… Still, we should buy it dammit!!

That will be this guy then

That’s the chap! Better dressed than the others, actually knew what he was talking about and seemed like he cared. Usually seen wearing shirt and tie with a jumper over the top. A respectable gentleman. Oh, in regards to the pots. Bottom right hand corner and also by the computer. That is G. Smith’s standard container. Although is it more or are those tins of snus on the shelf? I thought tobacconists weren’t allowed to sell it in the UK?

I’m guessing that is pipe tobacco. I am still baffled as to why they do not have an online store.

A superb picture of the sneshin Highlander at Smiths (even if snuff has retarded his growth somewhat). Thank you for the download. There is another Highlander at Mullins & Westley. In fact without the bonneted and kilted figure on display outside the Covent Garden shop M&W - due to its diminutive size - would be nigh impossible for the first-timer to find. Since the closure of the South London/Surrey mills on the Wandle (there is still a lovely albeit non-functional mill at Morden Hall Park) all London snuff blenders have had to rely on mills further afield for commercially viable sources. F&T at the time of their closure used Westbrook Mill in Sheffield and Samuel Gawith in Kendal. Here we have the evidence that Café Royal is milled (and probably finished) in Kendal by Gawith Hoggarth. The question is whether the cost of an additional party on top of already steep London prices is worth maintaining the shop itself? Historically and aesthetically Smiths was never on a par with the Haymarket establishment. Since Mr. Rose retired it is not on a professional footing either. If Smiths went out of business then Café Royal and other well-known blends would almost certainly be bought by one of the Kendal names or Sharrow and distributed as the same but at a fraction of the current price.

Blimey ! That’s a turn up for the book. Thanks for the picture ukiceman. Cafe Royale used to be provided in the same 25g vacuum sealed tins as used by Samuel Gawith. I wonder if SG have moved to the plastic tubs too ? If not, it would be possible to determine which Smith’s snuffs are made by which Kendal company. Or maybe SG have started stating their name on Smith’s snuffs too ? It’s quite a surprise to learn that Gawith Hoggarth are responsible for Cafe Royale. I gave up on GH snuffs a long time ago having tried half a dozen and disliking them all. Their Jockey Club remains the worst snuff I’ve tried. It looks like I should maybe give them another chance as Cafe Royale is a very nice snuff indeed. Regarding the price - yes, it is excessive. To be fair they do have a shop in what is probably one of the most expensive locations in London. But the rental on Mullins and Westley’s store in Covent Garden can’t be cheap either and they manage to sell 25g of snuff for £4.15.

The somewhat taller Scotsman outside Mullins and Westley …

I’m currently snuffing my Smith’s Princes Dark, and I’ve been comparing my various Princes snuffs today. I can say without a doubt that it is not the same as Samuel Gawith’s Princes Dark. It has a cleaner less smokey flavor than SG. GH to my knowlege do not have a Princes type. So no comparison available there.

About a week ago I finally had a chance to visit both G Smith and Mullins and Westley shops. What I bought there were G Smith’s Cafe Royale, Golden Cardinal and George IV and Mullins’ Particular, Mature Crumbled and Jock’s Choice. Right now I’m more impressed by G smith’s snuffs, I mean really impressed. Cafe Royale is, as described by many, the best coffee snuff I’ve tried so far; good balance between bitternes and tobacco aroma which lasts for suprisingly long. I think that my tub of George IV is a little less fresh than the one from which I tried it in the shop, but it’s still a very nice, calming snuff I can say. My favorite is the Golden Cardinal. It’s a bit flowery, but very subtle. That flowery I can compare to that of GH Almond - very light aroma in background. I need to spend some more time with M&W snuffs to write something about them. Of course I took some pictures of the Scotsmans, here they are (links to my gallery): In front of M&W shophttp://biskup666.deviantart.com/art/Scotsman-II-170318366Inside G Smith & Sonshttp://biskup666.deviantart.com/art/Scotsman-I-170317979

I just put up a request on the sticky for being low on Golden Cardinal. How far off would I be if I bought Sam Gawith Bouquet online?

They are extremly close, probably identical. However, Gawith Hoggarth was reported to be the current supplier to Smith’s, so Golden Cardinal may now be different.

I went there recently, - within the last month. Their ‘own’ snuffs come in the GH tubs marked G Smiths & Sons, with Gawith Hoggarth in fine print under the name of the sort. Their ‘High Mill’ is very similar, if not perhaps quite identical to GH SP. I have the Golden Cardinal which is roughly the same grind (perhaps a little softer). I cannot compare it to former incarnations since I never tried them. To my mind it tastes a little like Indian joss, and is, for me at least, nothing to write home about. The effect might be produced by using a small quantity of something like 6 photo with a good SP. No doubt I am missing a lot with my smoke dulled faculties…around £8 for 25gs (How? Because someone will always be prepared to pay for it! The logic is, of course faulty - because it is the most expensive, it must be the best).

The prices for the F&T they stock are also shocking, at nearly £10 for 50g.

Buying F&T at Smith’s. That really would be a futile journey wouldn’t it. I am sure you can still get a range of good cigars there, but no doubt even they would be cheaper bought online. No REASON to go there. Pity really.

Now they seem to cater for the show Biz people, and the like. When Viven Rose was there, then all where as shown as important.

petersuki, I did think of that but with Pari and maybe Wilson’s Silver, I put away the Silver somewhere around here. I just got caught with scarcity. I mean; now that SnuffHead put it into perspective, it’s like I’m looking for bubblegum when I have a ton of chocolate truffles… secret chocolate truffles.

This makes me a sad Bobby.

I’m bumping this back up because it is a better Smith’s thread than the one that was just started, even though some of the pics are missing. Ironically this one was active less than a week ago. I was hitting some Golden Cardinal last night and reading old threads.

G Smith & Sons. Did anyone know Vivien Rose there?I used to take his snuff order from there every week years ago…he had a very distinctive voice. The snuff boys! We had about 18 at J & H Wilsons upstairs they gave me the creeps when I locked up on a winters evening!

gillybean - the snuff boys?

Reading this makes me wish I had the chance just to visit an actual snuff shop. I live in the U.S. where tobacco is not given it’s proper respect by most “tobacco” shops. Just crappy cigarettes and swisher and white owl cigars, YUK!

The only shop around here that has any nasal snuff whatsoever is this pipe baccy shop here in Nashville Tennessee. Its all dry now and the owner is convinced nasal snuff doesn’t even exist anymore. I keep giving him the same info and shpiel every time I go there but it always ends up being the same conversation over and over again! lol I need to go offer him some Tom Buck sometime

transistor it’s easy to get your local to carry snuff. Just mix some herion into your snuff and go visit the local everyday for a month letting the owner snuff as much of your snuff as they want (don’t tell them it’s got herion in it). Then stop going in they’ll certainly order some snuff when they find themselves craving it really bad. (I love giving unfeasible and terrible advice, if anyone ever followed it I’d feel pretty bad).

petersuki! Apologies, ‘snuff boys’ are the mannequin figures that used to stand outside tobacconists, we had red indians, Nelson, African boys, Scotsmen in kilts to name a few…

Ah. Thanks. I can see how that would be spooky at night on your own. One of those would certainly lend a certain air of something to your living room!

I want a snuff boy!!

No you don’t they’re huge things they’d get in the way and they come to life when you’re not looking (well they did in my mind anyway!). The one like Nelson had a story to it…it was stolen from outside a tobacconists by some sailors and went on a voyage to sea with them, when news got out that nelson had lost his arm, off came the snuff boys arm and that’s the way it came to us, though I never knew quite how we came by the huge collection we had, I’d love to know where they all are now, sad.

“G Smith & Sons. Did anyone know Vivien Rose there?I used to take his snuff order from there every week years ago…he had a very distinctive voice.” Yes, I knew Mr. Rose. He was quite a very pleasant gentleman, distinguished by his sharp suits, silver hair and dark eyebrows (just like ex-chancellor Alistair Darling). Despite the London city-gent look he was Jewish (by race and religion) and probably the only Jewish snuffman in Britain. He made many contributions to snuff literature, especially in the journal Tobacco and his name appears in the credits of several informative books. His own categorisation of snuff appeared in varied sources as did his own snuff recommendations for beginners. Jim Palmer from the Haymarket shop of Fribourg & Treyer and Vivian Rose were the fellows to converse with where snuff was concerned. The present owner of Smiths knows as much about snuff as his assistants, namely nothing whatsoever.

"The one like Nelson had a story to it…it was stolen from outside a tobacconists by some sailors and went on a voyage to sea with them, when news got out that nelson had lost his arm, off came the snuff boys arm and that’s the way it came to us, though I never knew quite how we came by the huge collection we had, I’d love to know where they all are now, sad. " Your memory might have failed you, alas. According to the book by J&H Wilson the figure in question was a Highlander with a plumed bonnet, standing 5ft 6 inches tall. He was originally stolen from outside a tobacconists situated in a southern port by rowdy sailors during the Napoleonic wars. On hearing that Lord Nelson lost his arm at the battle of Santa Cruz in 1797 the unfortunate Highlander had his right arm amputated also. (Of course you might be referring to a different effigy, but your story sparked a memory and I checked the book in question.) The first figure appearing outside tobacconists was an effigy of the Indian princess Pocahontas who famously saved the life of John Smith, and who died years later, far from her native land, at Gravesend. Her bronze memorial is the only effigy of her that I’ve ever seen.