Hello fellow snuffhouse members. I would like to extend my sincerest apologies to all that were offended by the offering of what I thought were “tiger bone” snuff spoons in my latest snuff boxes. Last night I sent a letter to the e-bay seller that sells the snuff spoons. This was the response I received this morning: Dear friend, According to our traditional saying, it is called Tiger Bone. Actually, it generally refers to relatively hard bone. I once asked the master who processed them about it. It should be camel bone. - antiqueww I believe this statement, and do not think they would still be actively and openly selling them if it were false. I also apologize for my lack of knowledge of the situation with tigers being an endangered species that has been brought to the brink of extinction. As I have already stated I was under the impression that these were tiger bone because the original listing when I bought them on e-bay said they were “tiger bone snuff spoons”. Having seen bone snuffboxes, horn snuff mulls, yak bone snuff bottles, and camel bone chess sets many times for sale on e-bay I never gave it a second thought. The term “tiger bone” didn’t raise any red flags for me because I wasn’t really aware of the circumstances surrounding the issue. When I see terms like walrus tusk or ivory I do think about elephants and seals and such because I have heard those tragic stories. Please understand that I in no way condone senseless illegal poaching and bringing any species of animal to near if not complete extinction. When I saw that some members of the forum were upset about the spoons being “tiger bone”, naturally I immediately started searching the internet to become more informed about tigers. The poachers and people who commission them to do so are indeed after their bones. They have a very secretive black market that caters to those who refuse to stop using tiger bone for ancient medicines and wines. They are too valuable to them to be used to make toys or trinkets like snuff spoons. To make and attempt to openly sell such items would get them quickly into trouble. In China the trading of any part of a tiger is punishable by death. Understand that I am just a carpenter and craftsman that is trying to provide my fellow snuffers with snuff boxes that go a step beyond just a box by some mass producer that has no appreciation for snuff and our specific needs to make the snuffing experience more enjoyable. I have been working on this project for 2 years and have looked at all sorts of options for the spoons. I chose these spoons because they are “real” snuff spoons that were made to be used with snuff. They are sold with nearly every snuff bottle in the market. I also like that, much like my boxes, they are a hand crafted item and no two are exactly the same. I apologize to all for not asking more questions and doing more research prior to purchase, being mislead and in turn being inaccurate in my description, and also for not being familiar with the laws. Again, I am only trying to create a nice product with an antique flair. I am actively looking for an alternative man-made spoon to sell in addition to the current model. I am sending a note to Alex as well to apologize for the controversy ensued by my error and to request allowing an open thread with an accurate description.
I guess the devil is in the details. As the owner I have to make sure nothing illegal is going on here. Therefore I might be a bit picky sometimes, just to make sure we keep Snuffhouse running. Feel free to open up a new threat. Just don’t use phrases which indicate the use of illegal material. Thanks for the apology. 
@ onefortheroad - You made a bit of a mistake and that’s only human. Then you said sorry and that shows integrity and courage. You’re one of the good guys. Like Alex I had concerns about the repercussions not only on the forum but on yourself too had it been a genuine tiger product. I’m glad this has been resolved and I sympathise, it’s not nice getting a roasting from other forum members no matter what the reason.
Your change of heart is justified. The Rhinoceros and Tiger Conservation Act of 1998 - monitored by the Office of Law Enforcement of the U.S. Fish & Wildlife Service - prohibits the sale or importation of ANY substance derived from these endangered species and/or marketed as such. The claimed age of the substance is immaterial. The penalty is a heavy fine ($12,000) and/or up to six months in jail. Advertising your spoons as “beautiful hand carved tiger bone” seemed curiously naive rather than malicious and - despite what others have said - could have had serious repercussions. Glad to read that you have taken the advice of some here to heart. The best thing you can do now, as you realise yourself, is to make your own spoons from a guaranteed sustainable source so that your items may be bought with proper confidence. Your existing spoons remain tainted and should, in my opinion, be withdrawn. Less commendable are the sad comments from others that expressed the view that destruction of the world’s most endangered species for mere artefacts is “cool” and that killing of these vanishing animals is thereby justified. Fortunately the rest of the world desperately tries to stave off the extinction of rare animals by law enforcement such as the above act.
@Alex, thank you for accepting my apology. And no, nothing good could be gained by selling something illegal. It’s about the snuffbox and could have any spoon in it and be just as enjoyable. @MMUK- Yes, I made a mistake thinking they were tiger bone. Obviously, I was oblivious to the laws regarding tigers. I’m very relieved to find out they are not tiger bone and no laws are being broken. I thank you for politely pointing out the fact that there could be a legal issue if they had been. I respect the opinions of all our members. I wasn’t aware of the issues surrounding tigers. I can understand why some of you were so upset. I think others could have explained their position on the matter and would have found I was on their side of the fence. Either way I would have looked further into the situation.
Nice boxes Patrick, very, very nice! i will make an order with Tom monday to get me one of those.
I made my order for one today too! @onefortheroad i knew the bones were not real tiger bones this had been an issue before on E-bay. I really wish the sellers would’nt use that description for the bone spoons. I’m glad all this got worked out here so we can continue to talk about this remarkable snuff boxes! (at the same time i’m glad proof come out on this, Tigers are truely Great animals that should not be harmed in any way for anything)
When you buy from China, you never know what you are getting. Laws seem only to be occasionaly enforced for show.
I just need to put my opinion in here. You hear about people trying to raise money to save polar bears and whatnot from extinction. So that these ‘wonderful’ creatures can live so our children’s children can see them. Now think about it if the tables were turned. We are going extinct. Are the polar bears (or whatever animal you want to put in it’s place) going to try and save us? No, of course not. That would go against their nature. Their mission in life is to propagate their species and survive by any means necessary. Protecting their own offspring. They care not for the life of another species of animal. More food for them if that animal goes away. We have become to evolved.
+1 for the truth @ xander
@Snuffy: Most idiotic thing I have read today. Most idiotic thing I read yesterday was your other post on the subject. Just so you know… the reason why ANY animal goes extinct in modern times is because of US. @onefortheroad: Glad it’s “cleared” up. However, the fact that you would sell something that you really thought was made from Tiger bone is disturbing, the same goes for any retailer who would sell it.
…Survival of the fittest. We have gotten to the top of the chain but now we have to be “PC” about it. I personally don’t go around killing animals, nor do I support it for that matter…but I hate that humans have turned away from their animalistic nature and have to suppress the fact that we are no better than any other animal. You show me one other species of animal that tries to save another from extinction.
There is nothing “PC” about keeping a species alive, nothing. That species was here before us, does it not require our respect and deference? We have no reason to display our “animal” nature. Most of us eat meat, isn’t that enough? You say you do not support the killing of animals, but you sure don’t mind it for a stupid fucking snuff box._ You show me one other species of animal that tries to save another from extinction. _Humans.
Man there is so much evidence of some early humans respecting the animals in ways that sound a lot like modern conservation. I’d say just as much as being a predator on the food chain is natural to humans so is the idea of preservation and conservation. As far as other animals and speaking for them now there is a major human conceit that we have half an idea of what goes on with other animals. Constantly I’ll read about animals exhibiting unusal traits that would seem pretty natural to anyone who has watched similar species before.
“We have to become evolved.” That’s the only sensible thing you’ve said. We need to evolve past such naive attitudes. We have adapted to every climate and condtion there is on earth. We have perfected the art of survival. In fact we have done it too well. The only thing that can destroy us is ourselves. Every species has a role to play in the ecosystem. Its only when humans have departed from their “animalistic nature” that things have gotten out of balance. We can’t go back to that time. The only way forward is to foster understaning that our part is no longer to propagte and conquer, but to live in harmony and balance.
What do you mean we have no reason to display our animal nature? Our animal nature is what has gotten us this far. We want to further ourselves. We want to further our species. We lust, we get angry…all of these things are natural to us and should be praised, not suppressed. I am not condoning the killing of an animal for any use. Patrick didn’t kill any animals and neither have the people that have bought the snuffboxes. That animal was already dead. I can already see you making the point that “if no one is buying it, then it’s sale will stop being lucrative and therefore it won’t be produced”. That’s like vegetarians thinking they are making a difference by not eating an animal. As if their refusal to eat meat will cut into the profits of those producing it to the point that meat will not be sold anymore. I have to also say that I have nothing against vegetarians…you don’t have to eat meat. Don’t try to guilt me or change my opinion on the topic.
See now. This is how people get. I have not insulted you. I have not gone out of line. I am simply stating my opinion and disagreeing with you. I have nothing against you.
Please gentlemen, no insults or we close yet another thread.
No. Don’t close it. I will retract my statement.
I don’t mean to offend anyone. I really enjoy the community here at snuffhouse. We are a family. I don’t want to ruin any relationships with anyone. It is my opinion and I don’t expect you to agree. I have a very selfish view of the world.